officially sick of falkow

Strategies and Card File Construction

Re: officially sick of falkow

Postby friedtofu » Thu Sep 11, 2008 9:36 pm

Falkrow can be stopped. You just have to get them off tempo. Lawtia is my worst matchup... it sucks to play against them.

Counter attack (haha... with Lebeau as an actual card or Mad Dog, 40 DMG to all my guys) skills and screws me over so much. A well timed Shade can do pretty much the same. Take out the Sea Hunter with Assassin's SS or something of the sort and ... punch us in the face :) haha.

And. I took out Sorcerer Guard after I found out how weak she is... +10 def to 1-2-3 is good, but having someone that attacks (ie Undine) is even better.
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Re: officially sick of falkow

Postby Peralisc2 » Fri Sep 12, 2008 7:36 am

once you hit lvl 10 in this game you are fed to the wolves. it doesn't mater what deck you go against. that is why i think it is good to go into chat and talk to people about tactics. I learned a lot from asking questions. I am the worst duelest in the folrat. My RP attests to that. But I'm learning different playstyles and tactics. My problem is that i recycled all the cards from other races so i'm stuck playing gowen. With the second expansion there are a lot of cool new tactics that make rushing bad. A lot of that comes in the form of soul skills. Currently i'm running my Earth Dragon deck and i give up at least 4-5 life points to get him in play. But from that point on I'm not real easy to take down in most cases. I loose but not as much as I used to. If i used this deck in the lower levels I would rock a lot of people. A lot of lower lvl players are trying the game out like me.

There maybe needs to be another arena before Folrat. Maybe 10-15 or 10-16. That way people can edge into more hardcore matches.

I will not lie. I dropped gran for my deck. I've spent about 40 bucks for my deck. Plus I recycled a lot. That's the thing. Without spending gran your time lvl 10 and up gets rough. Very rough. This game has to make money and lvl 10 and up is how they do it if you want to win more frequently.

I disagree. There are few better cards, but the basic set is not actually that bad, it's just dosn't contain the few awsome cards that would make a large diffrence.
I don't recycle because am sure every card has some use, even if it's from another sphere, the diffrence is if it helps your current strategy or not.

What i am missing is an SP regenerator and one big mob of level 5+, or you can forget the mob, i would just use strong cards that i have from other spheres. I tried placing bonus SP Soul Card, but it's not really worth it, you get only 2 SP.

Falkrow can be stopped. You just have to get them off tempo. Lawtia is my worst matchup... it sucks to play against them.

Counter attack (haha... with Lebeau as an actual card or Mad Dog, 40 DMG to all my guys) skills and screws me over so much. A well timed Shade can do pretty much the same. Take out the Sea Hunter with Assassin's SS or something of the sort and ... punch us in the face haha.

Assassin soul skill is more about luck ... if you dont have something that you want to sacrifice then it backfires at you. So it could work some times.
But if you take sea hunter out with normal attack or even waste a spell card, then he just revives it...

The only way i defeated them is when they did mistakes, or when i played at my best and they did few mistakes.
With "mistake" i mean "they didn't play the usual falkow order".
I don't know the exact order, but i can tell which falkows play it and which not.
I even tell sometimes to the falkows i defeat how they should have played. XD
Alteil is pretty much well balanced. Sometimes you loose and sometimes the enemy wins.
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Re: officially sick of falkow

Postby Logress » Sat Sep 13, 2008 12:26 am

As the Falkow GM, I have to say, Falkow played perfectly is one of the most difficult to beat, but one mistake... just one little teeny tiny mistake can **** us up so bad it's hard to believe. My only advice is to do unexpected things and use range. I was trying out a Refess deck against CSquared's Falkow uber lockdown. He had me so locked down, I ended up bringing out ALL my Trick Shield Knights and throwing them in the back row, and had them use their (normally useless) ability to do DFx3 to a RANDOM enemy unit irrespective of range (and giving up their DF), then I used Dryad to give one back his DF so he could do it again. He had 6 units on the field, including Guard Leader Renally, Sea Hunter and Mage Paladin Destrier in the front row and the Witch Queen in the back (!) And I had pretty much not sent anything to the cemetery so far, so there were 2-3 copies of everything... but still, I got lucky enough with my hits and it confused him enough that it gave me room for a comeback. Unfortunately I still lost because I was too far gone at the time, but if I had thought of it earlier it might have saved me.
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Re: officially sick of falkow

Postby Csquared » Sat Sep 13, 2008 3:44 am

To all those who think Falkow is too strong, let me just say that I have never once beaten a Gowen Rush deck. Even my uber lockdown file, which was designed to be the ultimate anti-Gowen file, lost by a hair against KratosAurion's rush deck. Admittedly, it's because I prefer playing defensively, and the game doesn't quite lend itself to that. More on that later.

I definitely agree with Logress regarding the comment about making mistakes (and thanks for revealing my bag of tricks to everyone by the way. :-b). Refess is just as unforgiving of errors, and it's no wonder our Refess-Falkow match was so close. Though it's probably also no wonder why he and I both find ourselves favoring Refess when playing outside Falkow. Back on topic though, Falkow files generally have the most options open to them out of all spheres, which probably lends to the perception that they are overpowered. But those options can also lead to the aforementioned mistakes.

Just a general thought I had the other day and was discussing with others, but when you take a look at the spheres in terms of their weaknesses in the first set and in a very general way, the following can be concluded:

Refess: low AGI, low AT
Lawtia: Weak during day, virtually zero DF
Gowen: Low HP
Falkow: Depends on weak support cards, slow SP growth

Note how the second set pretty much solves one of the problems in each sphere. However, Gowen only had one weakness in this list. How interesting. Not that Gowen is perfect and can beat any file out there, but this probably contributes to the perception to some that playing Gowen is like playing Alteil in easy mode. Which leads me back to my earlier point.

It's generally hard to play defensively because AT is so much easier to gain than DF or even HP. But this was likely a conscious decision by the game makers since there are only 30 rounds, and if either DF or HP were easy to gain, it would lead to more draws. Basically, the game has to go somewhere, and standstills aren't in the "cards." But Refess and Falkow are the more defensive spheres, and in an all-out race between DF and HP versus the AT and AGI of Gowen and Lawtia, who do you think will win? That to me is why the two defensive spheres have mechanics like shield breaking, counterattacks, returning, and agi/rng manipulation. It evens the playing field. Whether or not that makes them overpowered can be debated, but I doubt anyone would claim that Refess is overpowered. So why pin the blame on just Falkow?

It's not like Gowen doesn't have the option of barreling through Falkow's defense and early game setup, or that Lawtia can't gain the upper hand through SP draining.

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Re: officially sick of falkow

Postby slashzero » Sat Sep 13, 2008 2:07 pm

This is kinda off-topic, but I'd like to point out something:

Gowen doesn't lack HP any more than Falkow or even Lawtia. Take a look at all the new rankup units, or even the level 4/6 units without rankup. Oh and don't forget your friendly neighborhood Fairy Dance and garden variety Blitz Soldier. The only weakness Gowen really has at the moment is they lack units that do something besides straight damage, but that doesn't matter because the only counter to that at the moment is high def, but like that even matters with Ex Defau, Flare Tornado and bunches of new units with defense-piercing skills...

Just thought I'd set the record straight.
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Re: officially sick of falkow

Postby Csquared » Sat Sep 13, 2008 2:35 pm

I'm not sure the record needed to be set straight considering I said specifically in my post, "in terms of their weaknesses in the first set." Anyway, I'm with you on this, totally. I was basically implying that Gowen lacks any weaknesses as a sphere in the second set, at least according to my little chart. I think the point is that it can deal with everyone strictly in terms of damage, which is what the sphere is really all about. I would even argue that they have plenty of diverse abilities (+HP, +DF, +AGI, -AGI, Autorest, etc.). And if this is true, then why all the fuss over Falkow?

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Re: officially sick of falkow

Postby slashzero » Sat Sep 13, 2008 2:43 pm

Oh, my bad, I wasn't paying close enough attention when I read your post.

Yes, then those are pretty accurate generalizations for the first set.
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Re: officially sick of falkow

Postby Leedon » Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:50 am

I only really have two issues with Falkow as a Refess player. The first is that I hate Azure Dragon. For a single SP he can buff the crap out of anything and everything to the point where what you have out doesn't matter. If the Falkow player has an equal number of units on the field to you, then most players units are wiped. If they're lucky, maybe they'll take out a low HP spirit. If you think of the other ways that anyone else can get this kind of advantage you would need to use a soul card(ei getting punched in the face or have units dying) and that's just one unit. I think of all of the things that my guys can do with 1 SP and the best I can come up with is that my spear chick can do 45 damage to someone's HP in range... if she's still alive when it gets to her turn and that's just one unit.

My other issue is that they have two cards in the starter that can target enemies. Magic Scythe does it for free, but in his range. The other guy is Eagle soldier. For 1 SP he can hit anyone he feels like. Generally, without buffs a Falkow player can take out almost any level 3 or below unit of their choice every round in the front two rows of the field and before any of my guys can even move. If I have a support character in the back row, they generally have low HP so they get wiped on the first turn(though they may get to do something before death). Yeah, Sea Crab can be annoying but I don't find him quite as scary as those two.

It's been said that the way Falkow wins is by getting ahead, and that's very true, but dare I say, isn't that how we all win?

The best I can come up with to beat Falkow is by taking out the singer chick early. Refess has two ways of doing it. The first is with damage soul cards. If I can kill off my own dudes and/or get punched in the face a few times I can stop her. The second is with the lancer ability. Refess has two cards with that ability and one's in the starter. For 2 points, if there's someone in reach in front of her, one of my two types of spear guys can stab her in the face for more than her HP as well as anyone else they find in their way. It's expensive but if I don't I'll get smacked around by surf 'n turf while I wait for my guys to remember they have shields on their turn to go.

What's out there is out there. The question is how to counter it.

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Re: officially sick of falkow

Postby Candi » Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:04 pm

Leedon wrote:What's out there is out there. The question is how to counter it.

Brilliantly put, AI wish more people had your opinion in that matter.

I should also like to say that the Folrart meta puts Falkow at the bottom of the stack. Set 2 left our controlling talents behind while all other sphere's got something juicy - we got Renally (who is one great big death machine if used properly - as is the case with all cards, but falkow especially). My old Falkow return/deep squid deck that did fairly well in Set 1 got thwomped, stomped and utterly annihilated by Set 2 decks - I just can't deal with what they have (meanwhile my Set 1 Lawtia deck still holds strong). The metagame is killing Falkow.

Now in Crest - different story, starter land brings with it a whole specialized can of worms with regards to Falkow - they are mean, ugly, cruel and controlling. We run slow tanks with AGI buffs (making them fast tanks), return, turn1 witches, sylphs, undines, targeting destruction and all around frustration and humiliation. What can I say, it's the falkow way.

So what do can be done about it? First of all - Magic Scythe soldier must die. That and Eagle Soldier are going to be - as was stated - snapping your toes off at every opportunity. Have a contingency plan for a witch opening - especially if you run gowen, your units are mostly level 2 and that witch is a threatening sight.

Falkow struggles most (or at least I did) against Gowen. What does Gowen do best? Rush. If you apply pressure, keep it on and the Falkow player can't build momentum that their deck needs- Vordore is a power house, but not if he's the only unit on the field. He needs allies to be useful. Falkow players don't have a lot of SP to spare, and are largely predictable - how many Falkow battles have you fought in which the order of cards played hardly changes? Or you say to yourself "here comes return"? It's because if you know Falkow you know it well - and there is an optimal way to play it. If you can predict it, then use that to your advantage, especially if you are Lawtia - you can time them shades to be most detrimental.

So what have we got so far?
Kill the targeting units, apply pressure and don't let up, use their predictability against them.

If you play Refess the best way to beat Falkow is to save SP turn 1 and play two level 3 for turn 2 and 3, but that risks being slammed by a shade if you are against lawtia. It's a tough world for starter Refess.
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Re: officially sick of falkow

Postby darklogos » Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:03 pm

i will say that the weakness of Gowen is more then low hp. Its that you can't get good defense outside of dyrad and dyrad soldier unless you mix spheres. The average speed of gowen is 3 but i'm starting to see more races with agi 3+ in folrat. Gowen will never get really good defense or really good hp buffs in a set. Those are the quickest things to take them out. I've had my field wiped by Combat monk soul skills its not funny.

The issues is that Falkow has undine and slph, that when timed right, gives them intiative even against the fastest decks. You apply soul skill buffs eventually you have survivability that can't be matched. Anything soul skill that gives their units agility placed in the first or second soul skill slot can mean they are setup for at least 2-3 turns minmum unless you have a field cleaner aoe opener or grimore.

The problem is that everyone is looking at the deck as the pure source of control when for Falkow. That shouldn't be the case. It has to be a mix of grimores, soul skills, and units. That is the real key right there. With more big monster decks control/debuff elements become more powerful. With one or 2 monsters on the field with lots of hp and big attacks debuffing hp or attack value makes them big wastes of time.

The most unused but benifical card i see Falkow has is water dragon. That card gets rid of all the other guys little gun, rushers, buffers, debuffers, and annoyers in one big tidal wave.
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