Set 2: First Impression

Strategies and Card File Construction

Re: Set 2: First Impression

Postby Logress » Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:54 pm

I would say that Refess got 2 great level 3's, Trick Shield knight and Holy Weapon Priestess. Trick shield knight's numbers are just right to give him deceptively great survivability on average, while unlike Folrart Shield Knight, he can attack (but NEVER use his special ability... unless he's going to die anyway). The priestess has range, shield breaker, and free targeted healing. She's the queen of second row survivability. Also, with free healing and more healing powers, Wisps finally become as useful as the other spirits. I asked some of the Japanese players to makes some good Refess decks, and 3 of 4 of them had all three of those cards in them. I also like Shrine Priestess because she's faster than the other starting cards (except Haste Soldier, who's the only one she can survive), so she'll actually get to use that DF. It remains to be seen if she can be the new opening move, but I think the biggest thing that hurt Refess in set one was average AGI. Over time, things like damage and DF average out, but for Refess in set one, AGI never did.
One thing about Recovery Powder, I think it's the best of all the SP boosting spells, because it can really be a lifesaver. The other ones (one round, one target buffs) are kind of weak. Setting off 2 recovery powders in the first half of the game will increase survivability and build SP.
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Re: Set 2: First Impression

Postby Phades » Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:55 pm

wait what, LP= 0? Then the person that used the card would automatically lose the match wouldnt they?
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Re: Set 2: First Impression

Postby Grain » Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:56 pm

Logress wrote:I would say that Refess got 2 great level 3's, Trick Shield knight and Holy Weapon Priestess. Trick shield knight's numbers are just right to give him deceptively great survivability on average, while unlike Folrart Shield Knight, he can attack (but NEVER use his special ability... unless he's going to die anyway). The priestess has range, shield breaker, and free targeted healing. She's the queen of second row survivability. Also, with free healing and more healing powers, Wisps finally become as useful as the other spirits.


That sounds like a big jump.

Then again, I don't know anything about Refess.

I hope you're correct.

wait what, LP= 0? Then the person that used the card would automatically lose the match wouldnt they?


No
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Re: Set 2: First Impression

Postby Phades » Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:00 pm

Logress wrote:One thing about Recovery Powder, I think it's the best of all the SP boosting spells, because it can really be a lifesaver. The other ones (one round, one target buffs) are kind of weak. Setting off 2 recovery powders in the first half of the game will increase survivability and build SP.

This depends entirely on how the "war of agl" which is the war of attrition goes in the first few rounds. If the refress side is getting closed units, then the powder won't matter much unless the damage is spread out liberally. I really don't see that happening though given the nature of the game, since falkow can target units and return them and gowen can directly target damage through open skills and things like the new salamander knight. Lawita i wouldn't call lacking, but the style of control it has doesn't add to focused damage or return style skills compared to the other two.
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Re: Set 2: First Impression

Postby DanTheTimid » Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:35 pm

Sadly in 2 boxes I failed to pull a single holy weapon priestess, but I have been running trick shield knights in every refess deck I've made. I wouldn't necessarily say they've helped me, infact this has been so far my worst day (record wise) EVER (I'm like 2-10 so far), but their similarities to sea hunter are pretty significant and well, theres a reason why sea hunter is so popular. I've yet to find a good time to use his ability (why does it even cost sp, permanently giving up your defense for one turn of +5 damage is cost enough) but he's proven a more useful wall then folrart shield knight since opponents can't just ignore him with their flying attacks and pinpoints and what not.

I tried running will-o-wisp earlier in hopes that he would prove more useful with the new set... but it never happened. I guess the biggest issue is that its hard to find a time when +10 hp will really make a difference in the early game, and in the mid to late game I tend to have more sp and better uses for it then a +10 hp boost. If anything I think Blessing obseleted Will-o-wisp, for 1 more sp you get MAX HP+20, HP+20, AT+10, and DF+5. With wisp you just get +10 max hp, +10 hp, and a nearly useless and extremely vulnerable unit on your field. I really think if their going to leave wisp with this cruddy effect he really needs a stat buff to make him atleast some what useful on the field (I suggest +2 RNG, +10 ATK).
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Re: Set 2: First Impression

Postby Grain » Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:37 pm

Will o-the Wisp was very useful in my Norweidenn file.

I got 4 consecutive wins.

It didn't work on anyone past level 9.
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Re: Set 2: First Impression

Postby Xovian » Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:53 pm

I've done a bit of testing myself.
The hardest part or most challenging part is figuring out how to make the best use of the old and new cards for any given sphere.

As to the cards themselves by sphere?

;a41 : I think got some help, but I do agree with some others line of thought, that being that it's time Will-O-Wisp (We currently have Will-o-the-Wisp) got put back into the game. The one sphere that is supposed to be all about SP generation and High HP seems to be lacking in those areas. I noticed this with EX too, Refess has lvl 2 cards that have more hp then many other spheres, but their level 3's often have less then other level threes. I do wish some form of standard was used for the cards.

;a39 : I think Lawtia pulled out very well, and the ability to make good files that do not rely on infinite night are here now.
They also have more unit killing capability, which gives them a bit more control that they were lacking. Of course the usual Lawtia, lets just kill everything, even ourselves, is still going strong with the set. The "2LP lebeau" ensures people will be packing an answer for that card for a long while to come. And you thought just one of em was bad enough.

;a40 : While no real massive boosts that I can see right off, the diversity and annoying "rush" Gowen is well known for sure has not faltered in the least. Even have seen some Iczers allow several of their units to die at once while using the new dryad to up sphere level, and drop a the Dragon Emperor, which out of the lvl9s, i say has the best open ability (-50HP from all units), given that by the time he comes out, your field is probably empty.

;a38 : I'm having to hold my thoughts on this one. Given the type of sphere (control based), it is a bit too early to tell how well Falkow made out just yet. I'm sure many Falkow players, including me will be testing various combinations for quite some time to come. However, one difference I have noticed so far is late game control for Falkow is much, much harder. With all the ways to generate Sphere levels, and even SP (though i dont think any of them are that great for any sphere, they should all be 2sp or less IMO) there are going to be quite a number of cards Falkow can no longer get rid of. Bouncing is now going to be a lot harder to set up, and will likely require cards that are not in the starter of the first set. And just to say, no, Falkow didn't get any new bounce.
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Re: Set 2: First Impression

Postby Phades » Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:07 pm

xovian1 wrote: ;a38 : I'm having to hold my thoughts on this one. Given the type of sphere (control based), it is a bit too early to tell how well Falkow made out just yet. I'm sure many Falkow players, including me will be testing various combinations for quite some time to come. However, one difference I have noticed so far is late game control for Falkow is much, much harder. With all the ways to generate Sphere levels, and even SP (though i dont think any of them are that great for any sphere, they should all be 2sp or less IMO) there are going to be quite a number of cards Falkow can no longer get rid of. Bouncing is now going to be a lot harder to set up, and will likely require cards that are not in the starter of the first set. And just to say, no, Falkow didn't get any new bounce.
Manipulation through [card=80]Aqua Sorcerer / Mystere[/card] may become more important due to the level scaling, but she isn't as fast as the more traditional combination of options that existed within the basic set balance. Water dragon and cemetary recyling effects might enhance that style of play, but i am skeptical till i try it myself with a more complete falkow setup.
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Re: Set 2: First Impression

Postby Justice » Fri Sep 05, 2008 8:46 pm

Are we sure Falkow has no more return? I could have sworn at PAX I saw a new trick they had....
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Re: Set 2: First Impression

Postby Cheezy » Fri Sep 05, 2008 9:32 pm

I'm lovin' the new Lawtia cards ;a39
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