Ultimate Magic Doll file help

Strategies and Card File Construction

Ultimate Magic Doll file help

Postby angolmois » Wed Aug 10, 2011 8:47 am

With 2 new character magic dolls this set as well as a new support unit, can we actually make a magic doll file that can be top meta?

First, the must haves:
- Shades
- Animus (as long as we use any Esria card)

Now for cards that warrant discussion. Previously, a command doll file is usually Lawtia only and so having 1 set of undead (usually hellsmoke or CAK) as a tank with one or two other non-character magic dolls is standard. With the inclusion of 70 hp magic doll tanks this set as well as Stronghold, we can revamp the entire CMD file and consider using these cards instead:

- Original 3 command dolls + Parts Recycle
- Awakened Esria
- Esria & Astaforce
- EX Esria
- Belfyna + Sylphs
- Sumer & Fellana
- Sumer + non-character dolls (Cannon, Heavy Shield, Fencer, Grappler, Exorcist, Mobility, maybe Covert...?)
- Prototype Noze
- Reborned Astaforce
- Scarlet Lily
- Dear Cattleya
- Annarose (always good and hot in a Lawtia file)

Any comments on which of the above cards can make magic dolls top meta?

So far I have tried Sumer & Fellana. They aren't that great considering that they have only 30 hp and their auto skill requires the enemy to have grims, which is unlikely during midgame (the time when you have dead magic dolls).

Btw, can you have more than one different Esria card on the field?
Last edited by angolmois on Fri Dec 30, 2011 9:04 pm, edited 8 times in total.
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Re: Ultimate Magic Doll file help

Postby Cookie2 » Wed Aug 10, 2011 8:56 am

What I can say from watching HB:

Yes you can have "normal" Esria and Awakened Esria on field at same time.

Maybe u can make a Meta with Esria but i really doubt it will be possible without her, its just too fragile against higher agi units (watched them getting massacred by buncles and wk) and I doubt ull have the file space to effectively use command dolls + non-character/sumer.
I guess many have used sumerlana and made the same experience: U barely come to use her Action skill.

I'm not that experienced with dolls, just saying what I watched so far.
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Re: Ultimate Magic Doll file help

Postby Xovian » Wed Aug 10, 2011 11:12 am

I added in Sumer/Fell, and she works well for the file, I do not think you are giving her enough credit.
Mid/Late game if you have extra sp she can be a valuable addition for upping the dolls ability to take damage.
I use her with heavy shield, since shield can't heal herself by resting. Her start skill is a bonus vs heavy grim use.
She also gives 2 effects for each card she takes, and her skill use does not even require a grim to be removed, the max hp/heal is still done with the 1sp cost.
The down and dirty of her? She's a doll file grimbane, that's her purpose and she does it well enough.

Even with the additions of sphere cards, I do not see a command doll file being viable if they multi-sphere heavily.
I could be wrong, but it's too much slow down for the file to go beyond two sphere outside of lawtia.
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Re: Ultimate Magic Doll file help

Postby angolmois » Wed Aug 10, 2011 11:42 am

So instead of spending precious SP to auto kill (Violet), destroy one row/column of enemies (Scarlet), or blowing up the enemy field (Awakened Esria), you are saying it is worth it to use 1 SP to deal negligible damage, grimbane (when my auto skill needs the enemy to have grims to work) and give one doll +10 max hp?
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Re: Ultimate Magic Doll file help

Postby GonFreeces31 » Wed Aug 10, 2011 11:55 am

I kind of thing the trickiest part is knowing when to work in Animus.
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Re: Ultimate Magic Doll file help

Postby Xovian » Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:30 pm

angolmois wrote:So instead of spending precious SP to auto kill (Violet), destroy one row/column of enemies (Scarlet),

Nope still use these just fine.
or blowing up the enemy field (Awakened Esria),
Don't use her, and frankly she isnt worth using in a command doll file. A regular doll file where you desire to rotate dolls on and off the field is a different story, but command dolls...nope. At least in my humble opinion, if you like playing a command doll file with her, more power to ya. However, I think you will be disappointed with the results.
you are saying it is worth it to use 1 SP to deal negligible damage, grimbane (when my auto skill needs the enemy to have grims to work) and give one doll +10 max hp?

The auto skill doesn't use sp. As to the ability, I said it can be useful. I've had all my dolls live vs an Allinid bomb because of it.
Which was tough for them to even get out because i grim baned them so much.

If you want to disagree with my assessment that's fine, but a generalization such as you have given isn't really a good argument.
Knowing when to play something, and knowing when to use certain abilities are just as important as the units and abilities themselves.
Going "lawl kill with violet ability" when she has 50+ AT generally isn't always considered the best choice.
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Re: Ultimate Magic Doll file help

Postby Teru » Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:24 pm

I don't know if you could exactly call it a MD file, but what I've been running recently has been:

Image

It got me a nice streak until I lost to Fierte Pixies earlier today.

The open is Defect-Shade-Astasria, or against Lawtia's T2 undead, Defect-Shade-Withdrawal. The T3 set has the bonus of getting rid of Defect; Sadgasm's TGC file (which is what the open of this file is based on) uses Sin SS, but I find that too ineffective, especially when your opponent expects it.

After that, Plant Mage usually follows with Astasria as a 70 HP tank to gen SP. Depending on the situation, either Ermitage or Sulana is set T5; Sulana if I expect a lot of grims or the enemy is being extremely aggressive and picking off too many copies of Astasria, and Ermitage otherwise.

The idea is to stay on the defensive for the majority of the early game, attacking only when necessary, returning dangerous units, and setting Church Paladin after enemy unit closes to off-tank and guard against damage SS.

Once I've generated enough SP, or once the opponent has a developed field, I set Catira against bigs or MD Cannon against mids/rushes. Catira takes care of Star Dragon, spaceship, and other high HP units in general like Shin, Bringer, etc. MD Cannon has a 2 SP full field wipe skill and can also tank from the front row with 70 HP (90 with Sumer) and can get upwards of 30 + 20 (Sumer) + 90 (Astasria) = 140 AT, though usually it stays around the 50-70 range. The problem is her AGI; I've usually just had Ermitage buff her for AGI and rely on Sumer's +1 AGI too, but when Ermitage isn't on the field and 2 AGI isn't enough it does become a problem (which I've recently learned in that Fierte Pixies match). Teching a Sylph or something might be a good idea.

It has a lot of weaknesses, though. You have to jump through some hoops against T2 Tidal on your Defect in order to get that first SS off. Against Serpent files that especially becomes a problem when they set Frog to engage your Defect (which you can remedy with a Shade Withdrawal; 2 Falkow isn't hard to get to). And Fierte is definitely a problem. The file also has a hard time gathering momentum against files that rush out aggressive mid-level units early in the game (Urgrant, Belus, Jack is also a hassle because he bypasses Church Paladin's open). It's a gimmick file, as most Gald SS files are.

I really don't get why more people don't use MD Cannon, though. She can tank, and she can wipe the field for 2 SP. Astasria's auto synergizes really well with her.

As a side note, Sulana is so good. 2 grims in one turn for 1 SP? That's like that one level 2 falkow unit what's her name. Except you also get back one of your dead MDs, and you also buff and heal an MD. And if you don't want to spend 1 SP, you're still grimbaning as a 0 SP auto skill. The only other card that has a 0 SP grimbane auto skill is Fellana, but she also self-grimbanes. A traditional MD file might have file space issues, though, and might have a hard time finding a turn to set her without interrupting the rushtime tempo that MD files are focused around.
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Re: Ultimate Magic Doll file help

Postby Anima13 » Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:56 pm

Just looking on that file already creeps me out :
I really dont want to meet it :D
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Re: Ultimate Magic Doll file help

Postby Xovian » Thu Aug 11, 2011 2:48 am

Here's my grim-less version of my command doll file.
It's fairly straight forward, it mixes both raw AT with special abilities, along with recursion of the various dolls. (Sumer, and Sumer/Fellana accomplish this).
It also sports one of the most annoying "end game" mechanics: Living Dead with high DF.
You'd be surprised how well it can work.

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I'm Chromatic, I embody all Spheres.
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Re: Ultimate Magic Doll file help

Postby Teru » Thu Aug 11, 2011 3:01 am

Three Sumers?! Do you even have enough LP for that? I mean, just your shades and your sumers, that's 5 LP already out of your 8...
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