Martial Artists: Where's the Kung-Fu?

Strategies and Card File Construction

Martial Artists: Where's the Kung-Fu?

Postby Romdeau » Thu Aug 11, 2011 5:12 pm

I have noticed a distinct lack of Martial Artist (MA) presence in Folrart. If we take a look at the subtype (Gowen only) there appears to be a decent mid-rush file waiting to be played. Combat monk and gaia gem monk are underpowered IMO so I exclude them from the MA subtype. However, with the DanDan buff that occured over 2 months ago-we have a pretty solid line up if you have all the MA (including the most recent Staff Master). Staff Master in particular was one of the few cards I thought was an excellent addition to the game (except her focus is poorly designed) if you have access to all of the MA cards. Both MA buffs compliment her very well and she has decent synergy with Kurina. If you factor these cards into account, her 50HP 3AGI as a ranged attacker is actually quite attractive. I feel she has particularly good synergy with DanDan and his auto skill, as the two combined can land a lot of hurt at AGI 3 with respectable HP.

Now bear with me, but you know how Bringer gets thrown into every Gowen file except pixies right? Well, what if you replaced him with Ovalus (now that DanDan is level 4) as an anti-big measure. He works fairly effectively and can tank to upwards of 120hp worth of damage. Even if you don't need his utility as an anti-big unit, he can still absorb a significant amount of damage and attack for a respectable amount.

Even if Ovalus fails, MA still have Monk of the Single strike to fall back on for emergency 1 shotting demands. With both MA buffs, he can potentially deal 100DMG to a unit for 1sp and 5AGI. Now, I'd rather not have to use it, but it's there if the user needs it.

Even with the minor gladiator change, I feel he still does not bring enough to the table to justify playing him. He's too slow and doesn't bring anything except a bit of tankiness, which you already have from Dista and DanDan.

Those are just some of my initial thoughts on MA and I feel they are a fairly underrated tribal. They aren't top tier meta for sure, but I think they are a force to be reckoned with and I imagine in further Sets (possibly EX too) we can expect this sub-type to grow even stronger.
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Re: Martial Artists: Where's the Kung-Fu?

Postby Pancakes » Thu Aug 11, 2011 5:29 pm

I wanted to play the new booty artist but the damn lotto wouldn't give me but 1 copy.
I can only use Bringer, BKR Jack, and returns cuz I'm a free player. It's my best shot at winning!
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Re: Martial Artists: Where's the Kung-Fu?

Postby Xovian » Thu Aug 11, 2011 7:06 pm

Romdeau wrote:Combat monk and gaia gem monk are underpowered IMO so I exclude them from the MA subtype.

I could agree with gem monk, but combat monk "underpowered"?
An attempt at a joke Rom?
It was a staple level 2 until recently (and still sees use).
The card often does not have trouble taking out level 3's, I'd hardly call it underpowered.

As to the theme itself, I just chalk it up to being one of the lesser themes.
Some simply do better then others, don't think this one is any worse off when compared to say sorc/archmage files, or assassins for that matter.
Many of the cards simply work best because of their own merit, not because of any combination (which gowen doesnt have a priority on).
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Re: Martial Artists: Where's the Kung-Fu?

Postby ProtoExemplar » Thu Aug 11, 2011 7:22 pm

All it really takes is for combat monk to consistently hit 20 damage 3 times in a row in one match to make one swear off the inconsistency forever as a competitive player.

I've tried playing Martial Artists as an underdog file before, but haven't really been able to achieve much success. One possible explanation for the lack of martial artists in Folrart might be that if one was playing gowen anyway, BKR/Jack Winston/Bringer or Pixies tend to be much stronger options to play.
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Re: Martial Artists: Where's the Kung-Fu?

Postby iambad » Thu Aug 11, 2011 9:45 pm

Romdeau wrote:I have noticed a distinct lack of Martial Artist (MA) presence in Folrart. If we take a look at the subtype (Gowen only) there appears to be a decent mid-rush file waiting to be played. Combat monk and gaia gem monk are underpowered IMO so I exclude them from the MA subtype. However, with the DanDan buff that occured over 2 months ago-we have a pretty solid line up if you have all the MA (including the most recent Staff Master). Staff Master in particular was one of the few cards I thought was an excellent addition to the game (except her focus is poorly designed) if you have access to all of the MA cards. Both MA buffs compliment her very well and she has decent synergy with Kurina. If you factor these cards into account, her 50HP 3AGI as a ranged attacker is actually quite attractive. I feel she has particularly good synergy with DanDan and his auto skill, as the two combined can land a lot of hurt at AGI 3 with respectable HP.

Now bear with me, but you know how Bringer gets thrown into every Gowen file except pixies right? Well, what if you replaced him with Ovalus (now that DanDan is level 4) as an anti-big measure. He works fairly effectively and can tank to upwards of 120hp worth of damage. Even if you don't need his utility as an anti-big unit, he can still absorb a significant amount of damage and attack for a respectable amount.

Even if Ovalus fails, MA still have Monk of the Single strike to fall back on for emergency 1 shotting demands. With both MA buffs, he can potentially deal 100DMG to a unit for 1sp and 5AGI. Now, I'd rather not have to use it, but it's there if the user needs it.

Even with the minor gladiator change, I feel he still does not bring enough to the table to justify playing him. He's too slow and doesn't bring anything except a bit of tankiness, which you already have from Dista and DanDan.

Those are just some of my initial thoughts on MA and I feel they are a fairly underrated tribal. They aren't top tier meta for sure, but I think they are a force to be reckoned with and I imagine in further Sets (possibly EX too) we can expect this sub-type to grow even stronger.


I don't want to sound like I am trying to pick a fight with you or act like I have more knowledge on the subject as you or anything because clearly I do not, but I respectfully disagree with you on your opinion on the weak cards of this subtype, I think those two cards are actually on par with the other martial artist cards. From my fairly limited experience of losing 20+ matching trying to make martial artists work, If you want to one-shot units endgame gaia monk is the one that can do it more easily then any other unit in the subtype. The few times I won with the deck it was because gem monk could kill pretty much anything when it got the chance to attack. Combat monk is more frustrating then bad because of the inconsistent results. But on average he is a decent level 2 unit.

I do agree with Ovalus 100% however, especially after they buffed dandan so he wasn't a level 5 unit anymore and could be on the filed at the same time as Ovalus. Simply having him in the deck gives you a much higher chance of winning against Big Ref and Big Red.

The problem I think I had with the deck when I was trying it was trying to force synergy when it might not even be worth trying. Like dista I used as either SS fodder with a buff that has marginal results as an open, or a SS spot to buff units that won't be able to keep them for long . In either case I found myself wondering if he is really worth including just because he buffs the subtype. If I had better timing it could be more effective, but then again I couldn't really pick and choose my spots when playing MA because of the lack of tanks and control. I will probably try it again soon just because we have more units to choose form now, but I am not expecting much to change other then me getting better with the deck with some more practice.
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Re: Martial Artists: Where's the Kung-Fu?

Postby Romdeau » Thu Aug 11, 2011 10:24 pm

I just feel Combat Monk is too inconsistent. Gaia gem I guess is a decent end game unit, but that 40hp and 3AGI just really deters me.

I've been playing some MA and when I have a set of decent replays I will post for everyone's review.
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Re: Martial Artists: Where's the Kung-Fu?

Postby Pancakes » Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:13 pm

It's worth it to splash 1 copy of combat monk. Because he can get a kill or do some good damage, and then get his butt whooped and then activate a SS. When you play Martial Artists it helps to do weird things like that on timing and SS. And yeah, Sakura is a must. You're just fooling around unless you add 2-3 Sakura. Compromises must be made. I'm just not sure pure MA could work. Though I don't have booty artist! I want booty artist! Since I have every other 5 star I guess I'll be point carding my first 3 star ever now.

When I play MA, I usually do a fake rush. Let my entire field empty and then play like a level 6-7 monster or dragon tank. And then put Olvaus. And then initiate the real rush. You can't let your opponent's garbage units wear out all your martial artists. Cuz that's wasteful.
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Re: Martial Artists: Where's the Kung-Fu?

Postby GonFreeces31 » Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:16 pm

http://vimeo.com/19371103

Martial Artists defeat Eternal Night.
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Re: Martial Artists: Where's the Kung-Fu?

Postby Icyman2 » Fri Aug 12, 2011 1:30 am

Distra is to dodge those fire arrows/any perfect damage stuff. He's not to be used as a buffer open.
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Re: Martial Artists: Where's the Kung-Fu?

Postby LuxLead » Fri Aug 12, 2011 12:39 pm

A couple months back I managed to top 8 in a community tourney using MAs. (I think the tourney was worthing's? It's been so long!)

This was before errata made them better.

They're definitely viable, I find the issue is that they don't slot well into the current playing environment. I also find that Dandan was actually stronger as a level 5... Every time I've ran the file in recent memory there has been some ability that only affects 4 or lower that ended up wiping him out. Very frustrating!

Combat monk is a very powerful card by himself... the issue is that martial artists in general focus on lvl 3 or above, and spending sp to revive combat monk is going to slow you way down.

I use gaia gem as more of a middle game answer to large tank units then as a late game. You should be including some ace late gamer card that is separate from the card type.
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