From a new player, to everyone.

Everything that doesn't go anywhere else.

From a new player, to everyone.

Postby Alexander767 » Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:20 pm

First of all, I want to say congrats to the designers of this great game. It's innovative in TONS of ways, and really different from every other tcg I've played so far, a breath of fresh air in an ocean of MTG clones. And it even has great art! Perfect, really.


And then, there is the bussiness model... :(

There is a reason why this beautiful games fares so much worse than a game that's just a half-assed copy of WoW tcg (you know what I'm talking about...) and even WoW tcg isn't really innovative, when compared to MTG!

The main problem, is in my opinion, having both randomized cards and restricted trading. Every real-life tcg has randomized cards BUT they have trading, and as such, there are third-party markets when you can get the cards that you need for your deck, or you can just trade them with other players.

Opening a super-rare cool card is good even if you don't want it for your deck... Because you can trade it.

What makes things worse is that the mechanics of the game really favor having a full set of a given card insted of 1 or 2 copies (of course I'm talking about everything but grimoires).

Point cards don't make things better, the exchange ratios are absurd, so you can't rely on it unless you're a SUPER hardcore player.

And there's the problem: the way the "geek" market works. Basically "fans are going to pay anything, so let's just charge a LOT". Selling to a super-specific niche of people that is willing to pay waay too much. Everything, from comics, to manga, anime, tcg's, tabletop rpgs manuals... Is way overpriced. Crack is cheaper indeed.

This is preventing the fanbase from growing.

The free-to-play model is, also, in my opinion, flawed. The FM lottery selects from a very small subset of cards so you can't rely on it for expanding your collection, the point cards are overpriced so they really aren't viable, the only other 3 ways (level up, monday gran, and treasure cards) are available only if you win, which really throws off new players (that, by definition lack both skill and a good card pool, so they are going to mostly lose).

A good (from a marketing standpoint) free-to-play model keeps you wanting more, makes you want to play, it throws you virtual candy for playing (NOT just for winning), after every game you feel that you've acomplished something. That you're closer to your goal.

This is lacking in Alteil. Picture this situation: you play, lose, then you've only gotten 20 FM that you're going to save for the VERY expensive point cards that have absurd rates of exchange... For ONE card. That's right, you've acomplished nothing.

The gran-per-day for playing mirage master doesn't really change anything, it doesn't makes you want to play more. Hell, it's not even making you play the game itself.

Why not a set amount of gran every third game you play in the day, for example? Say:

Lose all games: 5 gran
Win 1: 10 gran
Win 2: 15 gran
Win 3: 20 gran

Or something along that lines...

So, in resume:

--------------------------------
1) I love the game, it's REALLY good.
2) Randomness in card acquisition and no trading is not good. You can't have both.
3) Make it so that the player feels that he's advancing when he plays, even when he loses. That's the key to adictiveness, and adictiveness is the key to success. =)
--------------------------------

Please don't hate along the lines of "you don't want to support the developers because you don't want to pay, so GTFO". =/

I'd love to support the developers but I'm:

-Young (19 years old), in college and living with my mom and my brother, so I don't really have money.
-I don't have access to credit cards (mobile payment would help me a lot).
-The conversion from dollars to pesos (the local currency) is reaally bad. 1 dollar = 4,5 pesos. So if I want to pay 10 dollars, I have to pay 45 pesos.

It's my opinion that a f2p player can also support the developers, I can tell people about the game, I can click ads. Having f2p players makes for a bigger player base. (And a bigger player base attracts more people).

That's why I think having a viable f2p model matters. =)

Well... that are just my opinions. Please don't hate.

What do you guys, think?
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Re: From a new player, to everyone.

Postby LoneKnight » Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:58 pm

This is a very nice post, and so you get kudos for that... but, on the other hand it had been made multiple times.

Sadly, Alteil is in the hand of a Japanese company and they were (up until now it seems...) comfortable with how it was running. They just didn't care until money was coming in.

Maybe there's change coming or maybe it's too late, it's hard to tell. Still I'm happy to see people doing posts like these, showing that they still care about the game.
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Re: From a new player, to everyone.

Postby skillll7 » Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:00 pm

I love optimism.
Don't worry, we don't hate on the good people, we just troll them like every other online forum community. :lol:
Yay Alexander767!
Cute dog too cute...
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Re: From a new player, to everyone.

Postby Gota » Sun Jul 01, 2012 9:01 pm

Seeing as Alteil US keeps having to transfer ownership yet still doesn't change their business module is really funny.

Even a big "I (we) told you so" would not help at this point because lets face it, Alteil will never change their business module no matter what. Thats why many of us have moved on and spend our money elsewhere. Alteil is a really good game, no one will doubt that. Only thing is the business module is rotten to the core and without anyone in power to make a change for that, it will keep failing in the international market.

What works in Japan does not mean it will work elsewhere, if they can't get that through their thick skull, then Alteil US will just keep being in the red.


Of course this is assuming they are in the red but lets face it, if Alteil is a profitable game, why would it be dropped this many times?
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Logress wrote:Gota: I just looked at your lottery logs... I officially declare you the most unlucky man on earth.
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Re: From a new player, to everyone.

Postby GonFreeces31 » Tue Jul 03, 2012 11:53 pm

Yeah I know, great game ruined by incompetence.
The True Hero / Callonia
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Re: From a new player, to everyone.

Postby fargone » Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:55 pm

GonFreeces31 wrote:Yeah I know, great game ruined by incompetence.


This. 100% this.


If the business model remains the same, I fear no amount of making it more pretty will make a difference, and I'm sure the few remaining loyal players/payers will disappear quicker than a hippy at death metal concert.

How long can you flog a dead horse before you realise its no longer running?
GonFreeces31 wrote:
fargone wrote:I realise this is completely off topic, but Icy deserves the limelight more than others. Some of whom dominate the forums with their endless posts.


What, I make legit points too...
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Re: From a new player, to everyone.

Postby Icyglare » Wed Jul 04, 2012 7:32 pm

Who's alt posted this?
For a large amount of various Alteil Replays, try youtube link

<-- http://www.youtube.com/AlteilReplays -->

CEM guild brah!
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Re: From a new player, to everyone.

Postby Peralisc9001 » Fri Jul 06, 2012 5:31 pm

Icyglare wrote:Who's alt posted this?

Looks like a reasonable long complaint that i couldn't be bothered to read, so i'll claim ownership of this alt!
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perhaps until the game is actually improved through change or perhaps forever since there are so damn many other games and better things to do @_@
http://www.educatinghumanity.com/2012/0 ... anies.html
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Re: From a new player, to everyone.

Postby robbin » Tue Jul 10, 2012 4:24 am

Thanks for taking time for sharing this post...i found a lot of informative stuff in your post keep it up thank you.
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