so let's talk about EX cards

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Re: so let's talk about EX cards

Postby Illyasviel » Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:58 pm

Hmm. 400 Gran. An ungodly amount of money, for three cards which aren't too useful. Looks like I have no choice but to stop eating for a few weeks so I can buy Gran. Gee, thanks.

But wait, what's this?! You say I can earn the packs the old-fashioned way? How do you figure that?! I play Int-4 every day, that's 105 Gran. Plus 10 for ranking. Yes, only 10! Like many other free players out there, I SUCK AT THIS GAME! I win once, lose four times, and I've only been able to hit level 4 by this point by luck! So that gives me, what, three cards to recycle? Wow, 10 more Gran, that really tips the scales!

But it's not all bad! I can at least get two, despite the collector in me saying I need to try for one of each. To Hades with getting them to play with, I don't even play the actual game any more. Too much losing. I came back for the tourney, but that was it. I just play Mirage Master. And it'll stay that way, for a very long time. And I doubt I'm the only one. Every other newb you mods recruit 'for us to beat on' will either get tired of being beat on, or will do the same as me, avoid fighting for months until we have enough Gran to make a competitive deck. Mods, what you have to keep in mind is a very simple fact. THIS IS NOT JAPAN! You're trying to keep all these things close to how they are done in Japan, and that's admirable. But it also has problems. I think hearing so many people saying how hard it is to compete or find opponents proves that. Unlike Japan's version, this community is not several million strong. So charging an arm and a leg for just a few cards will chase a large percentage away. Yes, you can supposedly compete without paying real money. That requires a lot of luck, and a lot of experience with the game. Now me, I'm not lucky. And the most experience I have with the game is losing, enough that I've learned the only way to win is by the other person giving up!

Now let's compare prices. I'll go ahead and break the laws of reality, and pretend these cards are actually real. So I go to the store. I can buy a pack of Magic, 15 cards for $4. Or YuGiOh, 9 cards for $4. Or Alteil, 5 cards for $4. Not horrible. But what really makes it so bad is the rarity issue. Those other sets give you a rare in every pack, Alteil doesn't. So if you want to make a deck that can compete with those Level 10 plus bruisers, you either have to pray that they're dumb enough to fall for the same tricks they've seen thousands of times before (because using the starter decks are predictable. Why is it against the rules to show someone else's card file if everyone knows what it is anyways?!) And if they're already Level 10, I really doubt they're that dumb. So you, once again, have to depend on luck to have a chance of success. So being a good player is unimportant, what matters is being lucky.


But I don't want this all to be bad news, I really am happy with this game. It's fun, at least Mirage Master is. I really do neglect playing the actual game. But even so, the art is nice, and the game can be fun. So I will send in money I shouldn't be spending, and get the EX Cards. I'll probably buy more, too. I'll still lose horribly 70% of the time, so I won't play often, but oh well. Just keep in mind, mods. You can only naughtyword slap us so many times before you stop letting you. Give us a break. Put yourself in our shoes. Pretend you haven't been practicing the games for months, so you're as bad as us. Pretend you only get a tiny bit of Gran, due to a bad internet connection. Pretend you lose 9 out of every ten games you are in. Pretend that of those losses, three will be people who refuse to talk to you, and another three will only say 'gg' at the end. Pretend you only barely have enough Gran to get a fraction of what you'd like to get, so any hopes of building a halfway decent collection are lost. Now, ask yourself. Is it still fun?

(Seriously, I don't know if I hate this site or love it. The game can be fun when I'm paired with someone close to my skill. In other words, a rank amateur. But so often I get paired with Level 12s with 6 streaks and more, flashing rares and power comboes that leave me losing so fast I can barely type good game. I mean honestly, how does the game see fit to pair a loser like me off with someone with a Silver Star?!
But I still like the site, I just don't know how much I can put up with. I want to stay with this site, but I just don't know.)
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Re: so let's talk about EX cards

Postby shyster » Thu Aug 07, 2008 6:24 pm

Hear Hear!

I totally agree with everything that Illyasviel said. I have currently not reached the level 10 folart arena, but it is specially because of these thoughts, that I have put off reaching it. If I was not worried that I would run into people with an abundance of three, four and even the occational five star rare I would have already reached folart by now.

Especially about how real card packs always come with a rare, and the level of rare is what is up for debate or discussion. The fact that you could possibly get a pack full of one stars is rediculous, especially for people who did not buy Gran, that is at least a week or two worth of work to get.

Really at this point, anybody entering the folart arena, who has not bought any cards, is likely to face a battle equal to that of facing a GM. They will be playing people at least fifteen to twenty levels higher, which means more cards, and much more experience. Such people will become extremely discouraged upon such a thing happening again and again and they will likely quit if they did not know that it was coming.
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Re: so let's talk about EX cards

Postby teasel » Thu Aug 07, 2008 7:02 pm

so i checked the japanese alteil site... guess what?
Zagar EX is a lv 6 with 65 HP,AT 35,DF 15 who gets AT+30 if you have 1 extra sp lying around and has slash
Vordore EX skill is "Auto Everyone gets HP-10"
and LeFeu EX skill has something to do with ranking up...
XXX EX skill has a close skill that does 10 Damage to everyone
I don't think the intention of the EX cards was to arm everyone against Lebeau

ok i can understand the change on XXX as the japanese version is quite bleh but why everyone else got changed to anti DF skill then? i mean i really want to like this game but it's like every week i finds a reason to get annoyed at it :?
Last edited by teasel on Thu Aug 07, 2008 7:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: so let's talk about EX cards

Postby Phades » Thu Aug 07, 2008 7:10 pm

teasel wrote:so i checked the japanese alteil site... guess what?
Zagar EX is a lv 6 with 65 HP,AT 35,DF 15 who gets AT+30 if you have 1 extra sp lying around and has slash
Vordore EX skill is "Auto Everyone gets HP-10"
and LeFeu EX skill has something to do with ranking up...
XXX EX skill has a close skill that does 10 Damage to everyone

It is well documented already in the refress threads, showing that our cards are nerfed compared to the JP versions. The odd thing is that they are nerfed in ways inconsistant with overal balance in many cases and no real compromise made to bridge the gaps in some instances (read refress).
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Re: so let's talk about EX cards

Postby ANIMEniac » Thu Aug 07, 2008 7:22 pm

Was it not mentioned before that some of these cards were changed later in the JP version and so we just ended up getting the "new" version of the cards instead of their original rules? Also consider that some of the cards we are getting were out later in the set than what the JP saw. I think one GM said that there were many answers to Lebeau's SS before these EX were released, which would mean we are getting these very very early on.
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Re: so let's talk about EX cards

Postby Phades » Thu Aug 07, 2008 7:24 pm

ANIMEniac wrote:Was it not mentioned before that some of these cards were changed later in the JP version and so we just ended up getting the "new" version of the cards instead of their original rules? Also consider that some of the cards we are getting were out later in the set than what the JP saw. I think one GM said that there were many answers to Lebeau's SS before these EX were released, which would mean we are getting these very very early on.

Yeah, but lebeau style skills were also released AFTER the counters to it, rather than before in our instance. Seriously, this is effectively a different game from the JP version and the only thing in common is the mechanics.
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Re: so let's talk about EX cards

Postby GenXsis83 » Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:22 pm

I am ashamed to say that I bought one of the EX packs. On my defense I honestly thought there would be three
of each card. Though I enjoy this game I too believe the price for the EX packs are a bit ludicrous. considering
they "say" that the third card is free it means that each EX card is 2.00 dollars... and that is just too much.

Well hope we all enjoy this game and hope the people who brought this over hear our thoughts also. There needs
to be a good balance. I don't mind paying for games at all, but 2 cards for 4 dollars is too much.
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Re: so let's talk about EX cards

Postby Detrian » Thu Aug 07, 2008 10:35 pm

If you still can't see this is a retarded plot to make cash right off the bat you need a reality check.

Just for starters, there's absolutely no reason to mess with the game balance that the original creators spent god knows how long tuning and inserting a card ability that came much later into the game. If that was not enough to clue you in maybe this AMAZINGLY coincidental (and expensive, see below) release of cards that counter the #1 card players rage about might help you realize some stuff.

And then on to pricing, even if we were to give the blessed benefit of doubt to our admins and imagine the balance was tampered with for honest reasons, we'd still have to think about the pricing of EX packs being decided based on the flawed calculations that "most" players get around 400 gran every 3 weeks by playing mirage master (which we'll assume nets the average player 315 gran if played daily without exception), ranking (which we'll be pretty generous and assume gets you 90 even if that's impossible because there's about 3000 registered players and less than a 100 get more than 20) and card recycling (cards that cost 30g and give back 5 or 10 g most of the time except for the special few that get rares and the even more special people that actually recycle such rares) and then we'd have to discard all that seeing how this "calculations" are lies and prices are actually lifted straight off the japanese Alteil (which curiously enough not only get their gran cheaper but also get the card lottery at 10G a pop instead of 30, have 3 minigames to make gran off and get 4 cards per EX booster.)

Really, I'd stay quiet about this whole thing seeing how after all a business has to make money even if it's ripping off it's clients, but Logress' outright lies push this past business into mockery. Not only are they ripping you off but they are doing so with a smile in their faces and that is unforgivable.
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Re: so let's talk about EX cards

Postby Grain » Thu Aug 07, 2008 11:07 pm

Detrian wrote:If you still can't see this is a retarded plot to make cash right off the bat you need a reality check.

Just for starters, there's absolutely no reason to mess with the game balance that the original creators spent god knows how long tuning and inserting a card ability that came much later into the game. If that was not enough to clue you in maybe this AMAZINGLY coincidental (and expensive, see below) release of cards that counter the #1 card players rage about might help you realize some stuff.

And then on to pricing, even if we were to give the blessed benefit of doubt to our admins and imagine the balance was tampered with for honest reasons, we'd still have to think about the pricing of EX packs being decided based on the flawed calculations that "most" players get around 400 gran every 3 weeks by playing mirage master (which we'll assume nets the average player 315 gran if played daily without exception), ranking (which we'll be pretty generous and assume gets you 90 even if that's impossible because there's about 3000 registered players and less than a 100 get more than 20) and card recycling (cards that cost 30g and give back 5 or 10 g most of the time except for the special few that get rares and the even more special people that actually recycle such rares) and then we'd have to discard all that seeing how this "calculations" are lies and prices are actually lifted straight off the japanese Alteil (which curiously enough not only get their gran cheaper but also get the card lottery at 10G a pop instead of 30, have 3 minigames to make gran off and get 4 cards per EX booster.)

Really, I'd stay quiet about this whole thing seeing how after all a business has to make money even if it's ripping off it's clients, but Logress' outright lies push this past business into mockery. Not only are they ripping you off but they are doing so with a smile in their faces and that is unforgivable.


Ooooh! Someone's calling out Logress.
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Re: so let's talk about EX cards

Postby Romdeau » Thu Aug 07, 2008 11:51 pm

Grain wrote:Ooooh! Someone's calling out Logress.

Amazing, huh?
;loading
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