more xp for losses

User suggestions to improve the game

more xp for losses

Postby junitsu » Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:16 pm

so obviously losing constantly to higher lvl players who have lots of cards (primarily gowen after gowen after gowen, its very exciting /sarcasm) and getting like 1xp for my 10 minutes or so is quite irritating. im literally just conceding to gowen players turn 1 so i dont waste my time. im not saying new people who dont buy cards should be able to compete against those that have been around and attained/bought cards, but i do think the arenas should be more concentrated in their level range to help mitigate this, gowen rank up abilities should reward less stat bonuses, and im entirely certain that losing should reward more than 1 or 2xp. i seriously wont sit around and lose to gowen after gowen just because i didnt pick gowen and get 1xp for doing so.

i dont know the formula for xp on a loss, but i would hope it compares levels, perhaps rating, and just have a higher coefficient.
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Re: more xp for losses

Postby Romdeau » Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:23 pm

If you give losers a higher amount of XP, people could start abusing it by quitting immediately. Also, if you're losing a lot, it doesn't make sense to level you up faster into Folrart, and the formula just doesn't magically change when you get there. Yes you also think Gowen is OP there are plenty of posts around these forums explaining why they aren't, but you're entitled to your opinion so I'll leave it to you to decide whether or not you want to look up counters / reasons why it's balanced.

Get better. Gowen is not invincible, otherwise everyone playing the game would play Gowen all day, all night and everyone would say so on the forums.
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Re: more xp for losses

Postby Peralisc2 » Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:30 pm

I don't see why you mention level in your post, junjitsu. Those are mostly moded gowen starters which come along with a level 15 - 20 player often enough ... so i really don't think it's limited to certain levels.

I only will repeat what i said before. I can get easier and more wins with gowen starter than with the others.
Last edited by Peralisc2 on Tue Aug 18, 2009 4:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: more xp for losses

Postby Multi » Tue Aug 18, 2009 4:32 pm

sometimes I think these posts on how people complain about losing to people with more cards than them, but then complain about gowen are contradictory, since a lot of gowen you'll see is just like, modified gowen starter, which would mean most of the cards are available to level 1 iczers. The largest difference would probably just be the SS lineup.

I've seen Kazama in the training arena using gowen and falkow starter cards i think, i dunno for what purpose, but he does fine with them. I used the lawtia starter and did fine in folrart too, and large part of my losses come from the refess sphere (not star dragon). In fact, it's probably more true that the people who complain about gowen on the forums are just a vocal minority and/or people in crest. EVERY lower level can't be losing, you end up fighting against each other sometimes too. Afterall, it's a zero sum game, your loss is my win, and vice versa. Gowen starter is just easier to use than the other starters, (read brainless).

Instead of complaining, people should just stop having a case of the bads. I'd suggest getting advice from other players, but seems like the vocal complainers tend to lack reading comprehension skills a lot of the time. At the least, if you beat a higher level iczer, you gain a suitable amount of bonus xp.
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Re: more xp for losses

Postby Phenoca » Mon Aug 31, 2009 11:49 pm

junitsu wrote:and im entirely certain that losing should reward more than 1 or 2xp. i seriously wont sit around and lose to gowen after gowen just because i didnt pick gowen and get 1xp for doing so.

Yes that is so annoying.

My only suggestion is a use for FM.

Phenoca wrote:I would like to see players be able to purchase all of the following for 500 FM:
1 Instant Revival
1 Skeleton Warrior
1 Mercenary
1 Rapidly Flying Apprentice

Which recycles for 25 gran per 500 FM. That's the equivalent of improving the Starter Pack, plus giving an exchange-rate for your FM.


When I played Refess, I assumed that everyone had Instant Revivals. They are critical.

Romdeau wrote:Get better. Gowen is not invincible, otherwise everyone playing the game would play Gowen all day, all night and everyone would say so on the forums.

It is for non-Gowen starters.
There is just no simple way to get field-control against Gowen Starter.
Which is why there should be LP-loss based rewards... And no rewards for using "Give Up".

Romdeau wrote:I'll leave it to you to decide whether or not you want to look up counters / reasons why it's balanced.

One of the reasons people need to level-up is to acquire these counters.
There are not a lot of Starter Pack counters that survive a well-timed SS.

Multi wrote:Gowen starter is just easier to use than the other starters, (read brainless).

I guess you are right. Gowen Starter is not overpowered.
But it has more momentum. It's much easier to maintain field control, and the grimoires... Are deadly.

Multi wrote:I'd suggest getting advice from other players, but seems like the vocal complainers tend to lack reading comprehension skills a lot of the time. At the least, if you beat a higher level iczer, you gain a suitable amount of bonus xp.

:(
I feel this possibly aimed at me, since I always tried to stall using Refess. Playing Set 1 Starters vs. Set 3 Starters did not do anything to appease my morale. And I suppose I did read Logress' guides (those which were available at the time) and had someone train me, and copied ideas.

And it wasn't until I placed a Rapidly Flying Apprentice SS that I started rising over level 8. Seriously, I stay with my suggestion (see top) though I'm hesitant to give Mercenary to newbies. Anything as useful as Mercenary, but not as powerful?
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Re: more xp for losses

Postby Romdeau » Tue Sep 01, 2009 1:55 am

Phenoca, have you acquainted yourself with this thread?
http://www.alteil.com/forum/index.php?f ... =viewtopic

I also you recommend you take a look at this for a brief moment afterwords.
http://www.alteil.com/forum/index.php?f ... c&start=50
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Re: more xp for losses

Postby Multi » Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:58 am

nah phen, the reading comprehension thing was aimed at a few people who had recently been making topics about how gowen is instant win, but how they refuse to play a different sphere other than the one they keep losing with. Other players were giving them advice but they were pretty much ignoring or just flat out disagreeing with the advice given to them.
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Re: more xp for losses

Postby TICio » Fri Oct 02, 2009 8:34 pm

Maybe give more xp to matches vs the computer.


Vs gowen-starter i normaly have field control, with my chaos oggre, but i have to play around him, what makes my game extremily fragile.
Most times i lose dying because i only have 1 card to rez him in the starter(i have to get the skeleton master giving me the same card over and over).
But i can get table control(btw latwia starter is a ****** deck..at least a card to change the time to dark..).
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Re: more xp for losses

Postby Phenoca » Sat Oct 10, 2009 4:56 pm

Romdeau wrote:If you give losers a higher amount of XP, people could start abusing it by quitting immediately.

This is not the point at all.

Losing with 0 LP is entirely different from losing with 8 LP.

Taking gran away when you lose is just hurting players (should not apply when losing with 0 LP). The 1 Exp gain is just adding salt to the wounds (i.e. Exp = LP-loss is a better solution).
flood + Pakistan = hunger
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Re: more xp for losses

Postby Gota » Sun Oct 11, 2009 9:47 pm

To my knowledge, hitting give up grants you no xp and no FM, or was I misinformed?
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Logress wrote:Gota: I just looked at your lottery logs... I officially declare you the most unlucky man on earth.
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