miff

User suggestions to improve the game

miff

Postby methebest » Tue Nov 20, 2012 7:50 am

ok so like back in set 4 we had a card that gave both players 1 sp each turn obviously as it wouldn't be balanced if it only gave it to it's owner.

for some odd reason some bright spark decided that the new version of the card would be perfectly fine giving only the owner 1 sp.

i mean seriously.
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Re: miff

Postby Peralisc9001 » Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:35 am

And it being a tanky backrow unit that won't die so easy.

Even energizer bunny with auto instead of action and extra range sux in comparison.
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Re: miff

Postby Callonia » Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:03 pm

She's lvl 4. Requires some kind of commitment.

Hands off my miff. She is also the first sp genner for refess that doesn't die in a sneeze from a random gowen unit.
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Re: miff

Postby Peralisc9001 » Tue Nov 20, 2012 2:10 pm

Except she's an op powercreep.

At least her heal should be taken away. She's far too flexible and strong the way she is.
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Re: miff

Postby gadu » Tue Nov 20, 2012 2:48 pm

I think the philosophy behind miff was that Refess needed better SP gen support for it's L3 rushes to compete with Falkow returns. Instead, everyone uses her to pump out Guardian, Jude, & Bringer. Nice foresight balancers.
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Re: miff

Postby AqvasFire2 » Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:00 pm

Callonia wrote:She's lvl 4. Requires some kind of commitment.

Hands off my miff. She is also the first sp genner for refess that doesn't die in a sneeze from a random gowen unit.


This is why you're not on the balance team. Any SP generator dies from a sneeze from a random gowen unit besides marduk and urgrant, and they die from a sneeze from a random Lawtia SP denial.
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Re: miff

Postby WhiteDragon2 » Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:45 pm

gadu wrote:I think the philosophy behind miff was that Refess needed better SP gen support for it's L3 rushes to compete with Falkow returns. Instead, everyone uses her to pump out Guardian, Jude, & Bringer. Nice foresight balancers.

I do think she would have been made a level 3 if she was meant to help level 3 rushes...
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Re: miff

Postby Callonia » Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:53 pm

gadu wrote:I think the philosophy behind miff was that Refess needed better SP gen support for it's L3 rushes to compete with Falkow returns. Instead, everyone uses her to pump out Guardian, Jude, & Bringer. Nice foresight balancers.



Wanna know why? She's lvl 4, not lvl 3. Oh and the fact that lvl 3 solar kingdom sucks if everyone is spamming lvl 4s. Its doable but thrice as much effort and its more of protection against bkrs from overrunning them too easily.

Lvl 3 solar kingdom rush against an bkr file? Bend over.

lvl 4 solar kingdom rush against bkr file? Excellent and fair battle. Although Bringer is gay, but its more balanced out now that solar kingdom have nice lvl 5 unit with one sp action skill.

Although the comparsion between bringer/verlaat is just hilarious. If verlaat is alone on field, bringer will always kill verlaat while verlaat will need to hit bringer two times to kill him.


If verlaat is oneshotting your bringer, well, I suggest killing those other units on the field too instead of ignoring them? Verlaat is an scalable threat, the more units he have, the more of a threat he is, the less he have the less of a threat he is. While having same weaknesses that bringer experiences when he gets summoned early like an early bringer.

Personally I think gowen players is just whining hardcore for the first time because they had it easy for what, 10 sets. They were always the sphere to beat if your deck to mean that it's somewhat good. If you can't beat gowen, you suck.


Oh and DG opinion is invalids well because you worship gowen. See, I can do it too rawr.


About energizer bunny? That's just dumb comparison.

Noone will spend money to try chase down a 3x copies of him especially because he is in SET 1. And he is a 5*. And lacks Range! He is a rng 1 means he competes for a frontrow spot with meatier units.

Give him 2 rng and change his sp gen action skill to auto skill and make him available for cheap and part of solar kingdom faction then he will see as much play as miffy does. And while we're at it, give him something else and a better action skill to boot that makes it worthwhile picking him up as an "strategist" for your file. He's a dead wood and useless bug that I only have one copy of, and all I have to do to remind myself is just look at his card and go ugh useless. He's too much of a pain to work with when miffyre is part of same tribe.

DanDan? He was useless until he got errataed to lvl 4 then people start runnning him like nuts because he can actually work with other cards instead of being a useless lone wolf in the past. Energizer bunny suffers from this loner wolf problem like dan dan used to.


And do i need to stress the fact that lvl 3 solar kingdom files is not very pretty more? They get killed very very very quick if you're not running ex lapierre. And it takes alto of practice to find an decent combo with whatever frontrow and then you have to think difficult on what to do about your 2nd row and third row. And soul skills as well.


lvl 4 solar kingdom rushes is just more beginner friendly because they have just barely enough hp/df without need of an overpowered buffs from something like ex lapierre to survive the op abuse running rampant in other three spheres.

I should know, my first match in my first lvl 4 solar kingdom rush was like last year and the first opponent i drew was an bkr abuser bsrx with his silver star and it killed him good. Therefore it means it's good solid file. It didn't have that much def on units just like what, 10 or 20 def. Its weaknesses is the low attack power. Anything that punishes multiple attacks hurts it bad, oh look, just look at BER. Talk about power creep nurf.



Sorry but lvl 3 solar kingdom rushes is still in a rough spot and its a fact that you haters have to deal with it or just ignore it outright. They run miff, guardian, judie, verlaat because omg, their first workable solar kingdom rush after like what 10 sets for alot of people that doesn't bend over in a instant. Although i started in set 6.


And lvl 2 verlaat he's so useless. amazingly useless traitor that is better off leading an army of angels and refess lycanthropes instead of troops like his stature should hint at. Verlaat, the prince of lycanthropes and priests and shrine zero. Now, he's actually leading soldiers like he is supposed in the fluff that's nice.

Oh and all the rage dg is experiencing? I hope he never plays alteil 2 because he will be on permanent pms after being overrun over by a solar kingdom file there. I dont wish permanent pms on people cuz that would suck alot.




And back to miffyre, she spams lvl 4 because she's lvl 4 and since you already have that 4 in sphere set up, why not spam lvl 4s instead of 3s because you already did alot of work in exchange for better units that can withstand the op abuse from bkr spam. It won't be an exaggeration that they might be hunting bkrs in attempt to get revenge for all the times they killed their lvl 3 rush files.
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Re: miff

Postby fargone » Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:18 pm

Having the weakest individual units relying on synergy for survival and success refess is supposed to be sp generating sphere. That isn't sp sharing sphere, it's generating. Now that refess can generate sp, you want it killed.

I am not arguing that the new miffy may be too strong, but I see that as a reflection of her other skill, not her sp generation. I disagree that her sp gen is too much. If falkow can have urgrant and marduuk, if falkow can have owl sage and forrest child antilla, if lawtia can have shades and nightwings, then let refess have KP and miffyre. Refess needs more sp than other spheres to be competitive.

When are we finally going to let the individual spheres be individuals?
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Re: miff

Postby AqvasFire2 » Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:39 pm

It's not her other skills. That heal is rarely used. The start is only really helpful in 1 match--vs. EN (where it rocks EN's socks off, but that's another discussion). It's the fact that she generates SP for an auto, is far from squishy, and once you get Judie and Verlaat out, she hits for very significant damage--far more than any other SP generator does.

Also, all of your comparisons are invalid IMO.

UrDuk: with both of these, you might as well press give up whenever you come across someone opening shade, because if a Lawtia player is any good, you *will* be shaded, gafc'd, death's embraced, and exchange of souls'd (if not nightwing wyvern'd) and will face a developed Lawtia field by the time you get anything down, which will just tee off on anything you manage to play. GG sir.

Lawtia SP denial: far from guaranteed. The mark of a great Lawtia player is to know exactly when an opponent will leave SP open to hit shades and nightwings, and also when the opponent will be short on SP to time death's embrace and bitter destiny. That's far harder than "plop range 2 tough cookie that autogens SP forever and ever". I mean there have been games that I've kept my first miffles alive well past turn 10.

Anttila and owl: Anttila requires 6 spheres compared to Miff's 4. Anttila has a measly 30 HP and is susceptible to return. Anttila doesn't generate her SP on auto and then turn around and smack something. Yes, you *can* pullermia (in fact, you probably have to), which means a very inflexible open with something like buncle/rileira (if you're afraid of the backlash)->pullermia->mermaid obs->anttila, whereas Refess can just go citizens charity miffles. So miff comes out a turn sooner, is far more sturdy, and can rest or hit back. There's no comparison. And owl just gets picked off like nobody's business by anyone running salamander, or even shades.

One last thing: you didn't mention Gowen at all.

Now, one other thing: notice how you don't see any of the other spheres playing viable mids or bigs anymore? There's a good reason for that--and it's miffles. Namely when it comes to a long, drawn-out game, Miffles will just wear you down with that much more of an SP advantage. She doesn't require floating SP (gives the finger to Lawtia), is level 4 (eat your heart out Falkow), and has the most Hp of any SP generator in the game (55), and on top of that, generates the SP on auto so she can even rest.

Miffles's power is absolutely unprecedented when it comes to SP gen.

This is the proper nerf to her:

Start->auto
SP gen: 1->2 (or maybe even 2->3). I'm not even sure why it's an auto, but let's just go with it.
stats: HP 55->35. Agi 1->2. Range 2->3.
Action: that's fine.


I mean look, let's take a look at Mad Priest. He's sort of like an anti-miffles. What if you decreased his range from 3->2, his agility from 4->2, and increased his HP from 30 to 60? Get what we're talking about here?
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