Seasonal Card Upgrade

Ongoing Promotions and Events

Re: Seasonal Card Upgrade

Postby Shirozaki » Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:07 pm

Logress wrote:@Shiro The difference is, GP said pay 15$ because there's a small chance you'll get something REALLY AWESOME, otherwise you might be missing out. And I say spend 10$ (except - see bellow) for this specific thing of your choice with the parameters of the sale spelled out. I believe there is a difference between these two things.

Yes, there is no risk in this offer, but there is no gain either. Transparency does not protect you from your own foolishness.

This, let's call it graciously, so called offer rewards you nothing other than pieces of vanity, I repeat: You do not gain anything.
Furthermore most of these cards can and have been acquired by singular pulls from the seasonal lotto without spending anything at all. They are from a limited card pool available with various offers to make them much easier available. That has ALWAYS been a good thing about seasonals.
The idea of re-skinning the cards is a splendid idea Rom stole from LoL, but it is simply not worth it in the framerate you layed out. This is apparently obvious to everyone but you.

Sorry, you are no less a greedy **** than the bigsuits sitting in japan. Sorry, if you did not expect this result then I am afraid you are delusional.

Logress wrote:You all may remember when I first took over the game and I made huge posts about how pricing works and how there were two basic ways to fix or at least change it. One was the Market place, of which various events conspired against us, but we're pretty far into the new file editor which is a prerequisite. The other was revamping the entire game first and then addressing it (this is the content of most of the specific complaints above). Our forums search function should get you that stuff. In any case, I found that doing nothing had its own bad side effects so we occasionally do stuff like this. If you don't like it, ignore it. It's not for you and it's not your problem.

I remember, I also remember being pointed out that this approach would prove disastrous and that you need to get your arse moving, if you pardon the expression. Yes, a certain someone pointed out that doing nothing would eventually ruin you; and I am fairly sure this "event" is not moving it into the right direction.

I especially like the bolded part. I don't have to tell YOU how small the player base is, do I?
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Re: Seasonal Card Upgrade

Postby Kouseo » Sun Apr 28, 2013 7:09 pm

@Logress I PM'd you and whats the difference between "Outbox" and "Sent Messages"?
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Re: Seasonal Card Upgrade

Postby Logress » Sun Apr 28, 2013 7:33 pm

True I said that doing nothing may be disastrous, but I guess the takeaway here is that there might be worse things than disasters. Catastrophes? Depends on your vocabulary, I guess. Also, another takeaway from my previous giant block of text is that if the reskinning isn't worth it "in this format (framerate?)", it's not worth it period, although in X months if enough parameters have changed may be worth trying again. And it is true, it might not be worth it ever. Seasonals were designed with exactly the process Shiro described in mind, not this one. If the experiment is a fail, it is a fail. I'm not going to deny that. Although don't let it scare players hoping for a more vanity-based system. I understand that if Gran and FM were separate that i could make vanity Gran only and change the ball game.
Keep in mind, since a ton of seasonal art is 3* (a nice middle ground where you have characters that people like and connect with, but are not so rare that they are out of reach), for the average joe who's not planning on spending (much?) who just automatically edits the expensive stuff off his list of options, this event means he can switch a 3* card to seasonal for 250 gran. Which, considering the amount of gran most semi-regular accounts sit on, probably doesn't mean spending. So it basically is a choice of if he wants to do this or keep saving, and that's more or less all it means.

My test is basically, 1) how many people will choose to spend saved gran on this? 2) How many will grind for this? 3) How many will actually crack into the cashier?

If you want to get picky, given the potential based on number of players and spenders:
If this is a success, it will cover the time it will take to make the exchanges, do right ups, posts, etc -- and provide us with good data
If this is so-so, it will not cover the above, but will provide us with good data
If this is failure, it won't give us either.

But lets assume that this event is some kind of vacuum cleaner (that's what greedy people do, invent money vacuum cleaners, right?), that instead of sucking dirt (or just sucking) it sucks money. What would happen to the money? Well, 100% of our money goes back into the game, so it would mean by default we can hire more outside programmer-hours to get stuff done faster. Although this is kind of a unique situation, because if somehow I could make this event self-sustaining then it could do just that. Getting seasonal art produced has a fixed price. So, sales based on seasonals-per-rarity by user would allow me to calculate a critical mass of number of active users before commissioning seasonal art breaks even. At that point there's no reason not to just give everything a seasonal. Of course, that is a real change up. As Shiro says, seasonals already have a role, and this isn't it.
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Re: Seasonal Card Upgrade

Postby Scientiafide » Sun Apr 28, 2013 7:39 pm

Logress I'm actually kind of surprised by a lot of what you said. I feel like there are tons of fallacies in your post. I'd elaborate but you said:

If you don't like it, ignore it. It's not for you and it's not your problem.


So as a user I'd normally give you feedback but it's clear that you don't care about what we think, so why even bother. Let the game die out for all I care (coming from someone who's spent over $1k on your game btw).
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Re: Seasonal Card Upgrade

Postby cheongzewei » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:20 am

one guy who spends $10 to upgrade a seasonal...
or ten guys who spent $1 to upgrade the same card on a seasonal?

Which group is happier? (the ten guys) which group would be upset at themselves if they don't live in the us, and that $10 can be spent to buy lunch for 7 days (the rich kid)

Which group will spread news on how awesome the game is, now that new management is here, they are trying to actively get new players to join (Oh wait)

F*** these prices. they will only be reasonable when prices are lowered by 3/4th. and ex cards pricing is 3 star card pricing.

You will see a LOT more income. trust me. Long term plans.
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Re: Seasonal Card Upgrade

Postby Icyglare » Mon Apr 29, 2013 1:08 am

If you don't like it, ignore it. It's not for you and it's not your problem.


What a nasty spin on what Logress is saying. As much as I agree on this being overpriced, I don't know why people just don't NOT BUY IT and let it go.
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Re: Seasonal Card Upgrade

Postby Indignatio » Mon Apr 29, 2013 8:13 am

Icyglare wrote:
If you don't like it, ignore it. It's not for you and it's not your problem.


What a nasty spin on what Logress is saying. As much as I agree on this being overpriced, I don't know why people just don't NOT BUY IT and let it go.


I feel that some of the community are in an uproar, because as Logress pointed out in his very first this post "this is an experiment" and without some kind of feedback you cannot move forward one way or another. Yes, the data from whom actually utilized cashier for the event, or whom grind for the event, or whom used saved gran will be available but what would be missing is the (hopefully) constructive feedback from the people whom the experiment touches. I feel that the above quote is slightly dismissive.

I like to view the forum for a new event release as sort of a customer survey: you are going to have those that have a strong opinion about the product one way or another and will voice it fervently. You are also going to have those whom do not have a strong opinion one way or another. And you are going to have those who either say nothing or fill up the empty space with nonsense. But at the end of the day the people whom are vocalizing their concerns here are the ones whom care for this game. People would just stop posting and participating if they stopped caring.

I misconstrued gran for actual currency because I do spend on this game and I apologize for my ignorance on that front. However, the choices are to save for the event, buy for the event, or grind for the event... and for the last option and I do mean me personally: ain't nobody got time for that.

I appreciate the vulnerability, Logress and and I am curious as to what your take away is.
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Re: Seasonal Card Upgrade

Postby GOSCAR » Mon Apr 29, 2013 8:40 am

Actually that sentence is the equivalent of saying "Buy it or **** off."

If you don't think so, go sell a product and use that as your finishing sentence. See how much you sell. I know if I did that I would be fired from my job.

Icyglare wrote: I don't know why people just don't NOT BUY IT and let it go.
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Re: Seasonal Card Upgrade

Postby Scientiafide » Mon Apr 29, 2013 3:32 pm

Indignatio and Goscar pretty much summed up why that statement was inappropriate. There are players giving him feedback telling him the price is too high (but that they'd happily spend on the service if it was cheaper), and his attitude is: I don't care, if you don't like it don't buy it.

Interestingly enough, three people go on here saying it sounds like he doesn't care about our feedback and suggestions: not a response; however, shiro goes on here and calls him an idiot who doesn't know what he's doing: he feels compelled to respond, explaining his thought process. It seems to me that ultimately his goal is not to see what the users actually think of his product, but to convince us his ideas are good and valid.

Oh and his analysis on gran is total BS. I'd take the time to explain here but he doesn't care so why bother; not that I really need to, mind you, as it seems obvious to everyone else (aka the users) that the price is too high.
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Re: Seasonal Card Upgrade

Postby Shirozaki » Mon Apr 29, 2013 4:45 pm

Kouseo wrote:@Logress I PM'd you and whats the difference between "Outbox" and "Sent Messages"?

Outbox are messages you have sent but have yet to be delivered. Sent messages are sent messages that have been delivered (But not necessarily read, i.e. he "saw" the message, but didn't open it).
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